Episode Transcript
[00:00:14] Speaker A: Hi, thanks so much for joining me. I'm King Loki. I'm the editor of Death Wish Poetry magazine and the host of the Demon Toast podcast. And I'd like to thank you for checking out this video. This is a series where I interview the writers that are published through Death Wish, whether that's through our digital magazine or our upcoming physical magazine, to be announced very soon. I just want you to know that our writers come from all walks of life. Some of them are experienced, seasoned, practiced writers with books and publications that span digital and print, and others are just starting out. Some of them are my age, in their 30s, others are in their 20s, and still others are even older than me. And I just think it's fantastic that we here at Death Wish Poetry can cast a shadow like that as broad and dark that allows all these different, incredibly talented individuals to shine. So, hi, I'm King Loki. This is our writer's spotlight for Death Wish Poetry magazine. We're here today with one of our writers, Matt Ten Hove. Did I say that right?
[00:01:21] Speaker B: Yes, you did.
[00:01:22] Speaker A: Wonderful. How are you doing tonight?
[00:01:24] Speaker B: Very good. You're one of the few that gets it right, so I appreciate that.
[00:01:27] Speaker A: Well, Hoev didn't seem right. So, you know.
Yeah, so I noticed that in your, your biography you mentioned that, you know, you write for a wrestling site. Tell us about that.
[00:01:40] Speaker B: I do. It is for free. I'm kind of a freelance writer, but it's a website that I've been reading actually since I was in high school, to the point where I used to go to that website because I could not afford to buy the shows. So I would read their reports and I would follow along on the website while the show was happening live. This way I was informed and can talk about it with my friends the next day. And now I actually do some of those reports for them. So it's kind of come full circle. So I do some live reporting, just kind of like the play by play action so that the people like me from high school who, you know, don't buy the show, can just read what's happening. And then every once in a while, if I have the time, I'll write an article or two, which is fun. I enjoy it.
[00:02:26] Speaker A: Absolutely. I mean, in this space, I mean, like, it's pretty common for writers to be forced to have to build a CV and a backlog not being paid. So, you know, I feel that. But at the end of the day, you know, I say this as a, as a poet myself and a writer myself. It's about the art Right, absolutely. I do, I do. I have a little joke I tell, I tell a lot. There's difference in a poet and a park bench. One of these things can support a small family on it, you know, but that's neither here nor there. So you know, I, I thought that was fun because you know, I, I, I like watching. We, it's, it's probably the lowest form of theater, but it is, the things they pull off are spectacular. Do you have any interest in that field?
[00:03:06] Speaker B: Oh yeah, absolutely. And actually that's what I write about. I, it's the pro wrestling. So every once in a while I'll get, I'll get called in to do the WWE shows and do the play by play. But what I do for PWInsider.com is every Thursday I do the TNA coverage.
[00:03:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:24] Speaker B: Which is, you know, it's, it's not technically an independent promotion because they are on TV, but they've been around for about 23 years now and they actually reached a partnership with WWE. So if you watch the Royal Rumble, you might have seen Joe Hendry. He's the TNA champion, everybody believes in him.
And so I kind of, I basically do the coverage for TNA every week and then the pay per views and every once in a while those articles that I was talking about before.
[00:03:56] Speaker A: Yeah, that's cool because I took a, I took a look and I saw a lot of the Ultimate Fighter Championship stuff, you know.
[00:04:01] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:04:01] Speaker A: So that, that, that, that's pretty cool. That's pretty rad. So obviously you, you know, you were in our winter edition. You published a story with us called Happy Choice. A very, very existential, slow build kind of story with a really, really heavy ending there, you know. Yeah, really, really liked it. You know, the theme with a, obviously with our winter edition was hibernation, settling down and fit right in there.
Hang on, got the wrong file here. Just a second. So you know, I wanted to ask, I mean like is, is, is the name you're here. Matt Ten Hove. Is that, is that a pen name? Is there a story behind that?
[00:04:37] Speaker B: So for, for Matt Ten Hove. That's just me.
[00:04:40] Speaker A: That's just your name. Okay.
[00:04:41] Speaker B: That's just me. I was born with it. And it's a, it's a, it's a different unique name, I guess. Yeah, you don't see it too often, I guess. I've only met one other non family member that, that's a ten hoof in the wild. So honestly, when I started dabbling with writing, you know, a lot of greats have had Pen names. And you, I'm just, I'm assuming have a pen name.
So just, I was like, you know what? Let me just stick with me.
[00:05:10] Speaker A: Cool, that's great.
[00:05:11] Speaker B: Let me be me, you know?
[00:05:13] Speaker A: Yeah, no, I self publish my books under my legal name, Daniel Sokoloff. But King Loki is this larger than life Persona I do for Death Wish. Yeah. Oh, it's fantastic. But I, I really did think that was probably a pen name. I don't really assume. I don't really care personally. I mean, we have another raider named Marissa Jade, and I thought that might have been a Star wars reference, which it's not. That's just her name.
So. Yeah, I thought that was interesting, you know, So I don't know, what are your. What are some of your major influences, you know, when it comes to writing? You know, obviously the wrestling stuff is gonna be very functional, right? Utilitarian.
[00:05:46] Speaker B: But yes, absolutely, when it comes to writing. Honestly, what made me want to be a writer or at least get interested in writing was Edgar Allan Pope. I was introduced to him at a very young age, believe it or not, in. You got something? Yeah. He's my man.
[00:06:01] Speaker A: Mister.
[00:06:02] Speaker B: Yeah. So it was like, I think it was in fifth grade, if I remember correctly. My music teacher, he wanted to turn the Telltale Heart into like a little, like basic, like a little ditty. Like we had to like read it and then turn it into like a little song. And at the time I really enjoyed it. Looking back now, maybe fifth grade was a little, you know, too young for that. But I also, I'm speaking Now as a 7th grade English teacher who teaches Edgar Allan Poe. So that's only two extra years, you know, but it was interesting. I thought it was such a heavy, you know, deep topic that we were turning into a music piece, you know. But it was really the words that resonated with me and just the way that he brought such a gruesome, you know, story to life. And I was just fixated on that. And then when I found out that there were other short stories and poems, I gobbled them up. And Poe was definitely my first major, major influence.
As I got older, it turned into, you know, John Steinbeck and J.D. salinger. Kind of, you know, a little bit stereotypical, but, you know, they're amazing, you know.
[00:07:17] Speaker A: No, no, Steinbeck is fantastic. He's. I think he's a little underrated in academia personally. I mean, I've had professors that just didn't care for him personally. But I mean, getting back to Mr. Poe, I mean, I mean, he's the king. For most of my life, I didn't want to know about his life. I just wasn't interested. Like, I had a rough enough time being a fan of Lovecraft, you know? Enough said. Our first episode of our podcast, actually, we talked about his. His romance. Romance with Sarah. Helen Whitman, you know, poet he almost married. And it was pretty hard because I had to do a lot of research, and he was kind of an asshole. But a lot of artists are, so.
[00:07:51] Speaker B: That's true.
[00:07:52] Speaker A: You know, I mean, we're going through it with Gaiman and Marilyn manson and.
[00:07:56] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:56] Speaker A: J.K. rowling, and it's just. It's like, you know, don't eat your heroes. But no, Mr. Poe. I mean, the. The Telltale Heart. I mean, it's one of the greatest stories ever written. The way he describes the old man's eye, and, you know, this guy's fucking insane. But you're there with him and you're like, what are you gonna do? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the thing about Poe is, like, he lends himself very well to music, you know, not just, like, you know, lyrical poetry. Like the Raven. Of course, there's. There's the Bells with his usage of language and onomatopoeia. Like, the man was a genius.
[00:08:27] Speaker B: Absolutely. I don't know if you're aware, but a few. Well, I'm. Actually, maybe 10 years ago, there was a Broadway play all about his Life. And I went, and I'm sitting there, and it. At first, the. The person who was playing Edgar Allan Poe looked nothing like Edgar Allan Poe. And then the music was, like, very, like. Like the music behind it was a little bit upbeat, and then it would get a little bit dark. And I'm sitting there, and the first 10 minutes, I'm like, I hate this. Like, as a. As a po Lover, as a garbage, you know? But then they started, like, really diving into his works, and, like, the music changed and the scenery got darker. I was into it.
Cool. There was a song that featured the Raven poem that. Honestly, it's still on my playlist to this day. Can't get enough of that one song for sure. But just to kind of reiterate what you said, there is music to Poe for sure. And that play really captured it.
[00:09:29] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, people describe him as a drunk and whatever. I mean, he was. But, I mean, he didn't write like a drunk, so.
Yeah, no, I definitely feel that. I mean, there's a lot of. I mean, he's a pop cultural icon. I mean, there was that that stupid movie with. Gosh, who was that? Russell Crowe or something? Raven?
[00:09:46] Speaker B: Yeah. John Cusack, maybe.
[00:09:48] Speaker A: Yeah. John Cusack with the dumb haircut. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't watch that. Yeah, I. I. People at my day job don't even know who Poe is. Like, this one guy was like, was he on tv? And I'm just, like, looking at him like.
Anyway, no, no, no, for sure. We'll be here all night talking about Mr. Po, but, yeah, we could. I. I wanted to talk about you. So.
This is the struggle. This is the struggle. So. Yeah. So. Happy choice. It's a slow build. Its conclusion, I wrote here. It's. It holds its conclusion tight in its palm like a sharp poison barb. You know what I mean? How would you just. That's me, though. How would you describe the story? Is there any, like, sentiment about it or background you'd like to share about it?
[00:10:26] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't want to. I mean, I'm assuming anybody who's maybe, you know, who's watching this probably read, you know, the work, or hopefully they did. I don't know, but. So I don't want to, like, spoil too much, but.
[00:10:37] Speaker A: Well, I will say that we. We do start really promoting stuff this month, you know, if there aren't any eyes on it yet. I mean, there will be. So it's up to you, you know.
[00:10:49] Speaker B: Okay. Well, I'll say this. I. I actually loved your description of it. Kind of wrote it better than. I can really write it more write myself about the story. But.
[00:10:58] Speaker A: Well, it's my job.
[00:11:00] Speaker B: I appreciate that.
It's. I guess with the story, I like that you recognize that it was such a slow build. I definitely did that on purpose, and it's one of the things that I tend to enjoy when it comes to whether it's a TV show, a movie, or even a book. A lot of people will stop reading a book after 100 pages just because kind of nothing happened and things happen, you know? I mean, maybe you're not enjoying it, and I can respect that, but, like, things are happening and bubbling, you know, and I didn't. You know, obviously I didn't write more than a hundred pages, but I thought that things were bubbling as I was trying to tell the story.
And, you know, I kind of wanted to make it seem like my main character, Tim, was truly just having a normal day, a kind of a fun day, a day off, you know, and in some ways, I wanted the reader to just be like, man, you know, Tim's having a great day. And then at the End. When Tim makes his happy choice, it turns out that he was having such a great day because, in his opinion, he was having such a horrible life, you know?
[00:12:11] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:12:12] Speaker B: So, you know, I, I, I.
When it comes to, you know, the sentiment behind it, I just wanted to maybe, you know, just showcase that, you know, something. It's not always just surface, you know, you never know what somebody's going through. Just because it seems like he's having a phenomenal day doesn't mean that he is, you know?
[00:12:33] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, not too long ago, we lost Chester Bennington. Who knows what was going on in his head. You know what I mean? And Chris Cornell shortly after, you know.
[00:12:41] Speaker B: Yeah, I, I'm actually. I'm glad that you brought that up. Believe it or not, it wasn't just those two, but it was some other things. But, like, those two losses kind of hit me pretty hard, actually. I'm not in the right room, but I have a huge piece of artwork that has Chris Cornell, Eddie Vedder, who's luckily still with us.
Man. Now I can't remember their names. Kurt Cobain, Lane Staley, and Stone Temple Pilots. Scott Weiland.
[00:13:09] Speaker A: Scott Weiland, did he die?
[00:13:11] Speaker B: Four out of the five are gone. And they had such a huge impact on me in the 90s and even early 2000s as I was replaying their music.
So when Chester, who's not on that, which I wish he was, but when Chester and Chris, you know, took their lives, it was something that really stuck with me. And, you know, I'm just a fan, but, you know, you think, like, these people making millions of dollars would just be happy, but, you know, you never know.
[00:13:38] Speaker A: You don't, you don't, you don't. It's. It's rough, too. I mean, obviously he didn't kill his. Kill himself, but, I mean, you could consider a heroin overdose a form of suicide, I suppose. You know, Odor Sharunga. Steve Brocky from gwar. I mean, absolutely. I wasn't, like, a fan of GWAR at the time when he passed, but, like, when I heard that story in that documentary, I felt the loss. It was devastating. And when I see them live, it's just like, oh, my God, you know?
[00:14:04] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:14:05] Speaker A: No, Chester was a. Was a really. I mean, that. I don't know. You seem like you're. You're my age. I'm 34, 38, so not too far off. Yeah, I think we're the same generation, technically. Yeah. No, Lincoln park was there for me through some really hard times, man. You know?
[00:14:19] Speaker B: Yeah, me too. That Hybrid Theory was on repeat.
[00:14:23] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Hybrid Theory and Meteora were, you know, and, like, it's funny, I can, like, I can look back at, like, hard times in my life and be like, oh, yeah, that was when A Thousand Sons came out. I was listening to that over, you know, just.
[00:14:35] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:14:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Now, now, now they. They're back with their new singer, and it's just like, hey, you got to earn the love, you know? I don't know.
[00:14:42] Speaker B: Yeah. Super, super talented. Not the same.
[00:14:45] Speaker A: No, no.
[00:14:46] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:14:48] Speaker A: So, you know, how would you describe your process? I mean, what do you go through when you're writing? You know, I'm assuming a happy choice. That was a very polished story. There's no way that was your first story or your life.
[00:14:57] Speaker B: I. I appreciate that. That's true, honestly. So my process is, I think, I don't know, maybe weird. I actually don't get to write as much as I want to when it comes to fiction. Mostly. Mostly because I'm a teacher, and that's not an excuse. But when I do get home, it either. My free time is either thinking about work and, you know, how I could have done a lesson better or grading some work or grading some paper. Papers, or if there's nothing to do, honestly, I am just relaxing because the day takes a lot out of me. I love it. Don't get me wrong. I absolutely love my job. But for sure, you know, it's nice to kind of sit down and just decompress. So when I do write honestly, the process is usually what comes to mind first. Tends to be just a simple big moment that's going to happen in the story. And that big moment, usually in my mind is towards the end, if not the end, which I know is working backwards a little bit, but I think of it almost like following a gps. You know, if you know your destination, then you know how to get there. So if you follow the directions, then you'll get to your destination. And I kind of work backwards where I know, or at least I think I know where my destination is, and then it's up to me to kind of fill in how to get there, and then, you know. So I usually think of at least, you know, one big moment, and then it's up to my mind to, you know, figure out how to get there. And sometimes it's pretty straightforward and the easiest directions that you'll ever get, you know, just make a. Make a right turn here and then a left there, and then you're there. And then sometimes you Know, you get lost and you get in traffic, and next, you know, you're taking Jug Handles, you know, getting, you know, taking. Taking the wrong exit, you know, and coming back to it, you know. So, yeah, so the process is basically. I tend to know the ending, but let me see what happens and see if I get there. And sometimes, honestly, as I'm taking that road, the ending does change, you know, as all writers can probably attest to.
[00:16:59] Speaker A: Sure, yeah. If I didn't know you were from New Jersey, mentioning Jug Handles would have let me know. So I don't know who designed those roads, but if he was not human, you know.
[00:17:07] Speaker B: Not a fan. Not a fan.
[00:17:09] Speaker A: Nah, it sucks. I hate driving out there. But needless to say, no. Yeah. I'm very fond of George R.R. martin's quote about writers. You know, have you heard it? There's.
[00:17:18] Speaker B: I have not.
[00:17:19] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah. No, no, no. Whatever you think of Game of Thrones, I mean, you know, the show is a disaster, and I don't care about the property anymore because of that. Because he let that happen, but it's his fault. But needless to say, he has a. I think he's a very talented writer, and he has a quite the quote. He says that there's two kinds of writers, you know, there's architects. They know every single thing, every plot twist, every character's backstory, and they sit down and they write it and it's done, and they move on to the next part. And then there's gardeners. They plant their seeds. They till this. They, oh, no, this plant is dying. I gotta take it out and put something else there. The soil's on. That's how I roll. And, like, you know, there's no shame in starting at the end. I think that's how Doyle did it, frankly, you know? Yeah. So, I mean, like, you know, however you get there. But that's cool. Do you find that writer's block is an issue? I. I find that it's generally a problem with planning. But, I mean, you know, do you hit those. Those walls all the time?
[00:18:09] Speaker B: Absolutely. In fact, I have works that are started and nowhere near finished. Like, and I know where I want to go at the end, but I have no idea what the middle is whatsoever. And I have sat down and tried to outline, try to plan, and I'm just not happy with it. And it's just a complete block. There was also, I will flat out admit, there was, like, years gap in between some writings just because of various things. Part of it time, part of it, just because My mind just wasn't seeing fiction really. I was in. I was actually getting my masters and, you know, getting my career going. And I think it was like maybe seven years, believe it or not, between finishing one story and then finishing another story after that. And part of it was literally just like my mind could not see, you know, the, like, what to write.
[00:19:07] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I definitely feel that. And, you know, that's the thing. I mean, like, it's real rich for like, you know, Stephen King or whoever to these, These. These. These millionaires who have, like, movies, movie royalties coming in, you know, Like, I think working class writers like me and you, I mean, like, that's just not a reality all the time, you know. And like, you know, when it's someone like, like me or you, where you're not just working your day job, you're also doing like a hundred other projects, well, you know, it's gonna take a toll. I mean, like, you know, I have a novel I've been working on for. It was supposed to be done after a few months, but Death Wish and Demon Toast and my wretched job and all that stuff, all that nourishkite that just takes over your life. I mean. Yeah, no, that's fair. And I mean, like, at the end of the day, I mean, like, you know, I think that writers are generally. Even when they're not like, putting pen to paper, there's still stuff being built there. It just might be at a subconscious level, you know, very rarely.
[00:20:04] Speaker B: I was just saying. I 1,000% agree. You know, even now, like, when I feel like my writer's block is a lot better and I am actually starting to, you know, be better at putting words on the screen or paper when I can't. I do feel the wheels turning. You know, even if I can't get to piece of paper or a screen and just type a couple words, you know, my mind is trying to remember exactly what is formulating back there. And, you know, even things that I'm not working on, my mind is like, hey, how about this idea? And I'm like, all right, mind, that's enough. I got enough going on. You know, then I. Now I'm getting pulled in like a third direction. And I don't know, it's. I think it's a. It's definitely not writer's block, but it's not helping the process. On, like one project.
[00:20:52] Speaker A: Writing is. Is work. I mean, like, you know, there. My father's girlfriend got me this shirt that. It had like, pens on it, and it said, like, you know, weapons of mass creation. And I'm like, I'm never gonna wear this. I don't like the. I'm not into the whole writer. I'm a writer thing. You know what I mean? Like, obviously, like, I do all this, but, like, I don't know, there's like, a lot of, like, I don't know what the word is. Clout, chasing identity. And it's just like, are you. Are you writing anything? Are you creating anything? And I just think that, like, it really is a lot of work.
[00:21:21] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, my novel can. Can wait, you know, it's true.
[00:21:27] Speaker A: So I don't know, as an older, more experienced writer, I mean, I find personally that the meaning of, like, success is very malleable. Like, how do you perceive that word, you know, like, from where you. From your vantage point, you know?
[00:21:44] Speaker B: Yeah, that's. That's a great question.
[00:21:46] Speaker A: We're talking about art specifically. You know what I mean?
[00:21:49] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:21:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:50] Speaker B: And I appreciate it's one we all struggle with.
I'll accept the older but experienced. I'm still working on the experience. But when it comes to. When it comes to success and when it comes to art, writing, drawing, painting, just creating. Right. I like to just think of it, and maybe this is the teacher in me. I don't know. But did you have fun and are you proud of yourself? You know, that's kind of my success, you know, don't get me wrong. Will I accept some money? Sure. Will I accept my name getting out there a little bit? Sure. But at the end, I just, like, did I enjoy the process of that creation and am I proud of it? And if the answer is yes to both of those, then I think that it's a successful, you know, creation, successful experience, you know? And, you know, that's why I have a lot of really awesome students, and they're always trying to just chase that A. And, like, did I get an A? Did I get a hundred? You know, and they come to me with their writings and they're like, I don't know if this is good enough, you know? And I'm like, you know what? Maybe it is and maybe it's not. And yeah, I know I'm technically the judge of it here, but, like, I'm not the only judge in the world, you know? So, like, whether I like it or not, yeah, it impacts your grade, but it doesn't impact your life, you know, like, so, like, did you have fun writing it and are you proud of it? And if you are, then most Likely, like, you're going to get a good grade, but more importantly, you had a good experience.
[00:23:23] Speaker A: I think that's a. Yeah, no, absolutely. That's a great answer. I, you know, I could tell you now, like, I know people who are a little more successful than I am who actually, you know, they publish with the big. I'm not naming any names here, but they feel like they're spinning their wheels all the time, you know, trying. They're chasing book deals and all this, this, this Michigan. And it's just like, like I reached a point pretty quickly where I was sort of like, you know, I could keep, like, looking for an agent or I could just like self publish and write my next book. And I've been happier ever since because I'm writing what makes me happy. You know what I mean? And like, it's not garbage. I don't just write it and publish it. It's like, it's, it's a whole nightmarish process. But, like, you know, I mean, there are writers who like, get the. Get big corporate contracts and they're, they're in Barnes and Noble for like a month or two and it doesn't sell and it just disappears, you know.
So, yeah, at the end of the day, I mean, we don't really live in a culture that treats art with respect all the time. And I think that, like, that kind of stuff's gotta be nurtured and nourished and it's, it's very existential in its way, you know. So, yeah, I think it's great that, you know, you know, you have that outlook. It's definitely the right one to have, I think, especially in this space. So, yeah, I wanted to, you know, I think the fact that you're a teacher is really, really cool. I worked in education very briefly. I was a substitute teacher. It was, you know, right when I finished college. It was, you know, it wasn't quite. For me. I didn't, I didn't have the time to go back to school either. It was just, it was a thing. But I think that the fact that you do that, you know, takes a lot of fortitude. My boyfriend's mother is a teacher actually, so it's a very important job, especially, you know, where we are now as a country. But does, does being a teacher kind of influence your voice or how you write or how you think?
[00:25:09] Speaker B: Yeah, I guess so. You know, one. One of the things I love about teaching is that because I work with angsty, weird teenagers all day, they keep me really young, you know, so I'm, I'm approaching, you know, I'm getting close to 40. I'm gonna be 39 next month, as you can kind of see. I didn't cut my hair this week, so I am, you know, balding a little bit. I'm getting gray, but they keep me really young.
[00:25:35] Speaker A: The horror. Yeah.
[00:25:36] Speaker B: When it comes to, you know, having a voice, I feel like I do have the ability to like switch, you know, and understand and really kind of have different characters if need be. You know, my, my family growing up and even now, like I have grumpy old men in the family. I have. You have me who's like, you know, the, the middle tier. And then I don't have any kids, but my students are my kids. So like, I just feel like I have a wide spectrum of how people talk, how people think, and if it wasn't for the students, I don't know if I would have like the younger voice and the understanding of how to, you know, insert things that are still kind of relatable to today, you know, And I think in a lot of ways, you know, like, happy choice not to go back to self promoting here, but like, you know, happy choice is very heavy about mental health. And you know, today, I mean, it always was, but even, especially today, mental health is just so important and so topical and you know, so many people are trying to take care of themselves but also are lost some on how to do so, you know. You know, I do think like, luckily in today's world, you know, there are a lot of options, but, you know, it's, it's.
[00:26:54] Speaker A: It's.
[00:26:54] Speaker B: It's tough, you know, so being a teacher, I get to, you know, you know, see how kids are dealing with things. I know how I'm dealing with things. I know how I see the world, but I also know how the kids see the world. And I'm able to bring kind of a nice mesh of that into, into the writing.
[00:27:10] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. I took. It's been a minute since I read it, but I took a happy, happy choice to be, you know, the story of essentially a younger person anyway. And it felt very genuine in that respect because like, I love to talk about Lovecraft because he is like such a fascinating writer. Besides the racism and all that wonderful stuff, he just can't write dialogue at all. And it's because he sat in his room all the time and corresponded through letters because he was a freaking, you know, incel. You know, I know it was the 30s, but still, you know, the type. And like, you Know, like, you have. You're very good at writing dialogue, as it were, you know, I think I appreciate that.
[00:27:47] Speaker B: That's kind of what I. It's like, I'm not the biggest fan of myself as a writer, but when it comes to dialogue, I do think that dialogue is something that I'm pretty proud of. When it comes to dialogue, you know, I'm still trying to work on the details of the details.
[00:28:02] Speaker A: Sure, sure, sure, sure.
[00:28:03] Speaker B: You know, dialogue is something that I feel like I have a little bit of a solid grasp of.
[00:28:08] Speaker A: Yeah, you should always. I'm very hard on myself and it, it does help because, like, writing is an egotistical thing, just inherently. It does help to be aware of your flaws. So certainly, yeah. I feel that I did want to ask, you know, are there any other projects you're working on? Like.
[00:28:24] Speaker B: Yeah, I am. You know, I'm trying to work on a few things now, now that we talked about, you know, getting past that writer's block. It's just a matter of finding the time to sit down and really get things done. So truth be told, I'm kind of in the process and I'm kind of ping ponging back and forth between two ideas for novels or at the very least like a novella, you know, I. Again, I have, I have the ending, like I said before, for both, and I am outlining the. The rest of it for both. I have about you know, between 20 to 40 pages already for both.
[00:29:03] Speaker A: Mm.
[00:29:04] Speaker B: It's just a matter of sitting down, outlining more, brainstorming more, and then, of course, getting it done, you know.
[00:29:14] Speaker A: Yeah. Hardest part.
[00:29:16] Speaker B: Easier said than done. I have a couple other, like, short stories that I'm trying to fine tune that I work on in the, you know, interim when I'm, you know, still thinking about the other two. Two things that are in the background.
[00:29:27] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:28] Speaker B: But you know that the, the writing that I've been doing for the wrestling website also kind of like keeps me fresh. So, like, right now, all of the creative stuff is on the back burner just a tiny bit, just because I have two articles I really, really want to write for the wrestling website. So, you know, those are more. Those aren't stories, you know, those are just kind of two articles that I have going in the head. So I want to try to get those out within the next, like, week or so, you know. But yeah, I feel like I'm finally at a point in my life where I am writing at least, you know, maybe four times a week for, you know, a couple hours.
It just, it's not consistently, unfortunately on one thing, you know, but, but it's, it's writing.
[00:30:12] Speaker A: Yeah, that's just, that's just reality though, I think. I think it's cool. I try not to have too many balls in the air myself. I mean, I have my one novel I'm writing and just so I'd finish it, I ended up scrapping a bunch of other things. That's just. Yeah, it's just, it's just the reality of it, you know, you run out of time, you know. Do you think you would chase a publisher? Would you look at self publishing?
[00:30:31] Speaker B: You know, that's a great question because for me, I don't. Again, you've been very kind, but like when I do look at my writing, you know, I'm like, will a publisher actually be interested in this? You know, you don't know until you try though. So I do think like when I do finish a novel, I might, you know, send it out just to, just to see, you know, with no expectations. With the understanding that probably if I send it to a hundred places, there's a good chance I'll get 100 no's, and that's okay, you know, but I think, I think I would try for sure. And then I think if I get those no's, then, you know, I'll just reevaluate to see. See if I think it's good enough. Did I have fun and am I proud of it? And then if I am, then you know, I would explore the self publishing for sure.
[00:31:16] Speaker A: Sure, sure, sure. Yeah. No, that's the thing with.
I would assume, you know, you don't. I don't think you're a genre writer, right? Like you don't write like science fiction or fantasy or any of that. Draw some dribble, right?
[00:31:27] Speaker B: No, I, I tend to. I, I have so many interests that, like, I, I don't think I have just one lean that I stick to.
[00:31:35] Speaker A: Put them all in. Put them all in. You know, I've got werewolves and vampires and demons and all kinds of horrible things running around in my. I don't care. It's whatever. No, I'm kidding though. Obviously you know your art better than I do. Yeah, yeah. But I mean, like, you know, like your novella and all that stuff. I mean, like, would it be more literary fiction, you know?
[00:31:52] Speaker B: Yeah, well, there's two. The one would be more literary fiction and then the other one is, Is actually a horror story.
[00:32:01] Speaker A: Interesting.
[00:32:03] Speaker B: And I know it's two very different things, but you know, that's Kind of how my mind works, you know, I. I think I've been blessed and cursed with a mind that kind of understands and enjoys everything, you know? And by understand, I don't mean, like, knowledge. I just mean, like, I, you know, enjoy learning about so much, and I enjoy so many different types of genres that you.
[00:32:25] Speaker A: You can enjoy Edgar Allan Poe's beautiful writing. And you can also watch, you know, Rare Ripley, beat up Nia Jax, you.
[00:32:30] Speaker B: Know, that's exactly it.
[00:32:32] Speaker A: There you go. You know what I mean?
[00:32:34] Speaker B: Beautiful.
[00:32:35] Speaker A: The spectrum of art and trash art, you know, like just.
[00:32:39] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:32:40] Speaker A: That's.
[00:32:40] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:32:41] Speaker A: That's where I live. I swim between those two extremes. Nothing in the middle. I can't. I can't. I can't roll with that, you know, if it ain't trauma or it's not Robert Eggers, I don't want it, you know. Get it out of here. Get that out of here. That Wolfman 2025. Get that out of here. We don't got time for that. That Blumhouse trash. No, but. Yeah, no, you know, that's the thing, like self publishing is. It's a rough beast. It's definitely worth it to try to find an agent. You know what I mean?
[00:33:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:33:07] Speaker A: Worst they could. The worst they could say is no.
[00:33:09] Speaker B: Yeah, no, absolutely. And I'm very used to hearing, so what? It wouldn't hurt, you know, I would just, I guess, keep trying.
[00:33:16] Speaker A: There's nothing more brave than submitting your rating to be judged by someone you know. Very true. You know, I do try to send out rejection letters. People don't always take it very well, but I do try to send them out because some of the best criticism I've gotten was in those rejection letters.
[00:33:31] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:33:32] Speaker A: Yeah. Because it's very hard to find a workshop group, you know, like.
[00:33:34] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And it's better to hear no than nothing, you know?
[00:33:39] Speaker A: Yeah. I think that sometimes. I've gotten a lot of flight form letters over the years, so in those cases, I'd rather just have heard nothing. But you are right. It's better to know than nothing. As a good point.
[00:33:48] Speaker B: That's a good point.
[00:33:50] Speaker A: Do you have any, like, tools, any. Any special tools that you use for your writing, you know, besides, like, Microsoft Word? Do you play with. I forget what it's called. Did you play with any of that?
[00:34:00] Speaker B: So as just my. Right now. No. Yeah. So right now. And actually, it's even less. It's Google. It's Google Docs right now. It's Google Docs. And then I'll Save it. Like as. As a word. But it's funny you should say that. Like, last night, I think I had an ad pop up. It was like Scrivener, which I. I was like, looking into some. I. I saw somebody else, like, using some kind of tool. And I was like, oh, what is that? And I looked at it and it was like, $40. And I was like, I don't think I want to pay for it right now.
[00:34:29] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I don't play with none of that. And it's all overpriced garbage. Can't. Pandering to people's need to be validated. Oh, I'm a writer. I spend money on it, you know, it must be real. Yeah, that's what I was asking about. I was wondering if, like, you delved into that and found any fulfillment. Because people do, you know.
[00:34:48] Speaker B: Yeah, okay. I feel better now because I don't. And, you know, I. I do. Like, you know, it's not perfect, but like, I, you know, I pride myself on kind of knowing how to set things up and how to edit and whatnot. You know, as an elat teach English teacher, I should say, like, you know, if I can't. If I can't edit something, you know.
[00:35:07] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. What are you even doing? You know?
[00:35:10] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm sure things slip by, but, you know, for the most part, I. I do know what I'm looking for.
[00:35:15] Speaker A: You know, now the only things sure in life are death and typos, you know, so. Exactly, you know, for sure. No, I pride myself on my editing too. Honestly, there's a lot you could do with just Microsoft Word. I mean, I have a lot of presets and stuff. I don't understand the need for all this, like, specialized novel writing software. It's like, get out of here. People, they sell them for D D and stuff. It's like, just do it all in word. What are you talking about? You know?
Okay, do you have any words of wisdom for our viewers, readers, etc, anything that you'd like to share?
[00:35:48] Speaker B: You know, I think the only thing that is wise that I can say that, and I kind of said it before, is just, you know, if you are looking to write or if you're looking honestly to do anything. Right, just have fun doing it and do it, you know, don't think about it. Right. If you're thinking about it, that means that you're not doing it. You know, if. Then that means you're not enjoying it, you know, so, you know, like, to be honest with you, like, before, I Started writing for the. The website PW Insider. I was sitting there and I was just like, man, I wish I can write for PW Insider. What can I do? You know? And here's the thing. They're not going to call me. I have to go to them. All I did was just simply write something and I didn't even ask them. I just sent it to them and I said, hey, you know, no pressure. Take a look at this. If you're interested, feel free to use it. You're not going to pay me, at least not right now, but feel free to use it. And they looked at it and they were like, cool, we will use it. And then next thing you know, without even asking, I sent more and more and more. And then they started asking, you know, and I enjoy doing it, so I went after it. That's what I recommend, you know, just have fun, whatever you want to do. It does not have to be writing. It can be any form of art. It can even be, you know, I want to get into video games. Start playing video games then, you know, and just have fun doing it. And it's. It's going to be a good experience if you give it a try, you know?
[00:37:07] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. And I think building on that, I mean, like, a lot of websites, they do have a pitching process, you know. Yeah. Like, I don't know, crack.com. i know they have, like, a forum you can join and you can pitch articles. Yeah. There's no reason why, if you're a writer and you're like, hey, I can do something to build a cv. Like, chances are they're taking submissions or at least pitches. So, yeah, that's fair. That's, you know, and I think that's really inspirational, frankly, you know, that this was a site you followed for years, and now you're like, hey, I'm writing for IT now. I'm part of the team, as it were. Right. It's not the New Yorker. Right. But.
[00:37:39] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:37:39] Speaker A: Who cares? The New Yorker sucks. They have unfunny cartoons, you know? Yeah.
Are there any books you wish you'd written?
[00:37:47] Speaker B: Every single one.
Even the bad ones or the unpopular ones. Because you know what? They did it and I didn't. You know.
[00:37:55] Speaker A: You know, even the Dean Koontz novels.
[00:37:59] Speaker B: You know something, he did it and I didn't. You know, so he's out there making it happen.
[00:38:03] Speaker A: He's the Jay Leno of literature, you know?
[00:38:06] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:38:06] Speaker A: You know, that's funny.
[00:38:07] Speaker B: But, you know, like, in all honesty, like, it is the truth, you know, like, I every single, you know, I go to Barnes and Noble and. Or I try to go to local ones, but there's just not enough of them.
But, like, I'll pick up a book and I read the back and it sounds like something I don't want any part of when I put it down. And I say to myself, could have been you, you know, and so I do. It's. I, I wasn't, you know, I laughed at myself just now, but, you know, just off the cuff, I really, truly do wish every single book out there was, you know, something that I gave a try to give you, I guess, a better answer. I think of things, again, just like, going back to, like, my favorite authors and the books that really inspired me. If I could have written Catcher in the Rye. It's the book, you know, it's the stereotypical high school choice, but it's the book, truly, that inspired me, you know, and it's the book that everybody kind of, you know, goes to and everybody has an opinion on. It's either it inspired me and I loved it, or, man, that's so stereotypical. But everybody knows it and everybody has an opinion. And J.D. salinger did that, you know, that's something that is amazing, you know.
[00:39:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:39:24] Speaker B: And again, maybe that's going towards more of the, you know, popularity choice. I think of books like A Head Full of Ghosts by Paul Tremplay, which I, I will give that credit for getting me back into reading, even though I'm an ELA teacher and I should be reading all the time. But I, you know, I took a. I took a break from reading fiction because I was doing my masters and I was just reading textbooks for, you know, years and years and years. So, like, I was like, you know, I'm so focused on the work that I just stopped reading fiction for a little bit. And then when I was finally done with my masters, the first book that I picked up was A Head Full of Ghosts by Paul Tremblay. And I was like, this is, you know, I've been missing fiction so much, and I just love that book because it's gross and it's weird and it's out there and it's so ambiguous at the end that my girlfriend and I actually had a very in depth conversation because neither of us saw it the same way.
And to this day, she still doesn't see it the way that I do. And I think that's beautiful because we can probably politely argue about it for the rest of our lives, you know, and because she sees it the Way she sees it, she actually doesn't like the book. And because I see it the way I see it, I absolutely adore the book. And we'll never probably be on the same page. And that's amazing. And I wish I can do that to people with my writing, you know? So. Yeah. So, you know, that's. It's. It's. It's books like that that really come to mind where I'm like, I wish. I wish I had that ability.
[00:40:53] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. I think it was To Kill a Mockingbird, you know, the movie. I think Walt Disney saw that. He was like, man, I want to make movies like that, you know, people. Because good art should. I should challenge you. You know, me and my boyfriend, we read this book called the strange case of Dr. Strange, Mr. Norrell. And it was this long, bizarre, giant, profoundly British novel about sorcerers, kind of. And a fairy maybe. It was very political. It was very weird. And we carried it around for months on end reading it because it was so long, and I still don't really know what to say about it. It was just a very weird novel. I'm reading a book called Mordu right now that takes place in a weird world where I think everyone lives on a giant dead God.
Getting back to Catcher in the Rye, I mean, like, that was a novel I didn't understand. When I was in high school, I was like, what's this kid's problem as an adult? I'm like, yeah, everyone's a phony. Fuck the world. Get out of here. I.
Yeah, and that's the key thing. I mean, like, you know, I started a website and just started, like, hitting people up on Instagram, and before I knew it, I had a bunch of people helping me and stuff. It didn't take much. It just took some will. And, you know, a lot of what you're saying resonates, and I think that it's inspirational for a lot of people. You know what I mean? Like, appreciate that. You just got to try, you know? You just got to try. It's better than not trying, you know?
[00:42:11] Speaker B: Absolutely.
[00:42:13] Speaker A: Yeah. I think that that's about it. Was there anything else you wanted to say? Anything else you wanted to get out there or talk about?
[00:42:20] Speaker B: Honestly, you know, I just wanted to kind of thank you. You know, I'm extremely appreciative, not just for sitting down with me today, but, you know, you took the time to read my story, with which, you know, I'll be honest with you, when I sent it, I. You know, I. I wasn't sure Because I know only one person had read that story besides me, and they said it was okay. And I. I don't know if I truly believed in it, to be honest with you. And, you know, it's a. It's a story that I think is a little bit, you know, risky to talk about, you know, now that it is out there and thanks to you, published, I have. I've worked up the guts to actually send it to a few other people to, you know, kind of for multiple reasons. Number one, let them know that I did this. You know, hey, I did this. And number two, to get you some hits on the website and. Yeah. And, you know, for the most part, it's been overwhelmingly positive. And it's a story where people actually are like, wow, this is pretty good. And also, are you okay? And I see, yes. You know, it's. Yeah, that story is not me. I mean, there's elements of me in that story, but.
[00:43:28] Speaker A: Well, anything you write is. It's. It's coming out of you. There is a certain aspect of it, but I don't think you're there, you know?
[00:43:35] Speaker B: Right. No, exactly. And, you know, and I just wanted to, you know, it's a story where I was actually trying to just talk about that topic and maybe get some eyes on it. And it's been. It's been amazing. So I. I wanted to thank you. I am very appreciative to have that story out there. I'm very appreciative to be on here now as well. You gave me two things I've never done before, and that's have a story out there in the world and also show my ugly mug to whoever's watching this.
[00:44:05] Speaker A: Hey, now. Hey, you can't say that stuff about yourself. You need at least one person in your corner.
[00:44:10] Speaker B: That's true.
[00:44:11] Speaker A: Well, at any rate, thanks for being with us. I mean, you've been great. Matt ten Hove, please read his story. A happy choice link below. Read it or I'll come get you. And, yeah, write poetry, you know, make art. Love your demons. Ave Satanus. Hey, thanks so much for watching that. Our writers are the lifeblood of what we do here. And, you know, I really hope that something, you know, inspired you from what they said, because they've all been very insightful and fascinating in their own way.
Listen, we do take submissions. We are quarterly. And, you know, if you want to know when our physical edition is coming out or when our digital edition is open for submissions, please check us out on Instagram link below or go to our website we're usually pretty loud about it. Also, if you want to support us, you know, if you join our patreon at the $1, you know, level, or any level, really, I will personally send you one of these really cool stickers. And they're pretty big, they're pretty high quality. So, you know, put them on your car, put them on your back, put them on your wall. I don't know, put them somewhere. Or head over to Great Satan's Emporium and buy a super cool mug or a T shirt and, you know, support us. It helps to support independent art and. Well, stay tuned for what comes next. Most likely more interviews and always more Demon Toast episodes and episodes of Monster Fangs as well. So. Ave Satanas.
