Goosebumps Nostalgia

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Yeah. So, guys, you guys remember Slappy the Dummy? Remember that? Yeah. Yeah. So I have some insults from him. You tell me if you're insulted. Okay. You need a checkup from the neck up. [00:00:13] Speaker B: I'm Betty. [00:00:14] Speaker A: Is that your face? [00:00:15] Speaker C: Just a little rude. [00:00:17] Speaker A: Yeah, it's a little rude. Is that your face, or did you forget to take out the garbage? Nothing. Okay. Oh, pretty bad. [00:00:24] Speaker B: Yeah, that was mean. [00:00:26] Speaker D: All right. [00:00:27] Speaker A: Where did you two meet? A nerd circus. Okay. [00:00:29] Speaker C: I embrace my. My nerd status. [00:00:32] Speaker D: Yeah, that fits. [00:00:34] Speaker A: You're so dumb. You stay up all night studying how to pick your nose. [00:00:37] Speaker C: Yeah, so this is gross than anything. [00:00:39] Speaker A: Well, so. [00:00:40] Speaker C: From the. [00:00:40] Speaker A: From the twisted mind of R.L. stein, we have goosebumps. Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Demon Toast, the podcast of Death Wish Poetry magazine. I'm King Loki. That's Old Norse for Daniel. And I'm your host. And with me are Adrian, our resident painter and dreamer, and Erica, our literary scholar and awesome person. And joining us is a special guest, Sy Marie, a poet who's appeared in our fall edition. Sy, how you doing? [00:01:06] Speaker D: I'm doing great. How about you guys? [00:01:08] Speaker A: I mean, I can't complain. So me and Adrian, to some extent, anyway, grew up with R.L. stine and his work. Erica. Sy, is that. Is that true of you? [00:01:19] Speaker D: Yeah, I was in, like, the Scholastic Horror Book Club when I was in fifth grade and got all of them. [00:01:25] Speaker A: That's cool. That's cool. [00:01:26] Speaker C: I spent a lot of time in the library when I was in school, and that was. 90% of what I picked up was goosebumps. Or when I was getting into, like, graphic novels, like the Bones series. [00:01:40] Speaker B: Okay, that one was actually really good. I didn't know that anyone else had read those. [00:01:45] Speaker A: Now that you mentioned. Now that you mentioned the Scholastic Book Series Club, I don't know what that is, by the way, but that reminds me of. We did have book fairs. And, like, you know, there were lots of the little Goosebumps books, but things like Animorphs also. And there were probably other series that escaped my memory, but books just like this, small, you know, small enough to fit in your pocket or your book bag and written in a digestible format for kids to read. Right. That's kind of a thing. It still is a thing. But this very much. These were largely some of the first books I read personally, you know, and it's interesting that a guy like R.L. stine moved on from Fear street to writing specifically for kids, isn't it? I actually haven't read Fear Street. Have you guys read it? Yes, yes, absolutely. Love them. Interesting. [00:02:33] Speaker D: So it starts with the Fear street saga, and of course, there's the Netflix series now if people want to watch that. I actually really liked it. I think that it was pretty well done. Being a fan of the original book series, I got a hold of that when. I think I was, like, 12 when I. And I read all three of them the same summer after I had already read lots of the Goosebumps series. So I was like, okay, I've read every single. And consequently, I was going to the library and getting books from there and, like, doing summer library reading, you know? So I had read all of the Goosebumps they had, and the only things left on the shelf that were R.L. stine books were Fear Street. And I got. I think the first one is the Burning, maybe. No, wait, let me check. It's the Betrayal. Yeah. So the Burning's the last one. So I got the Burn, the Betrayal. And I've always kind of. This is giving a little bit of info about it away, but I've always kind of liked, like, old witchy or, like, Salem witch trial type stories, and it's kind of got an element like that. And it's about the Fear family, which is the people that set up this town. And it. It just drew me in because he did such a good job of illustrating this founding family and this curse and all of these really epic things that lend to other parts of the. The series. So it's really awesome. [00:03:55] Speaker A: Interesting. Yeah, he's a guy who really understands his audience in an incredible way. Like something that struck me with this book in particular, this is Night of the Living Dummy. It's not the classic cover that everybody loves. I found this at a used bookstore. But something that I got was lots of alliteration, lots of very short, compact sentences. And he has a real knack for giving his characters an inner life, which I noticed was missing from a lot of the episodes of the TV show, which he didn't write. He would introduce them. He was involved, but he didn't write them. And like, like. So at the beginning of Night of the Living Dummy, these two sisters go into a house that's being rebuilt after there was a fire or something. And the one says, I wonder who's gonna move in. Maybe cute, adorable guys will move in next. And I'm like, they have wants, they have needs. They have. You know what I mean? They have preferences on things. And that's something you don't really see in a lot of kids media. They're they're very like, for lack of a better word, sexless, uninteresting sighted, you know what I mean? And R.L. stein was, you know, a middle aged man writing this stuff, you know what I mean? The Night of Living Dummy episode has none of that, you know what I mean? I think it's interesting that he was able to take what worked for teenagers and translate it into a digestible format for little kids, you know, and this stuff was huge. Do you guys remember Curly, the skeleton with the pink mohawk? Yeah. [00:05:19] Speaker B: You had to remind me of him today. Yeah, I had completely forgotten him. [00:05:24] Speaker A: Very 90s, very edgy, very cool. Kind of like if the Crypt Keeper, you know, didn't eat spiders, I guess, you know. Right. And like, you know, like, there's a lot of like, value in these books too, which I think is very fun. Like, I, I opened up reading some of Slappy's terrible jokes. I. I mean, there's a ton of them in this book. Knock, knock. Who's there? Jane. Jane who? Change your clothes. You stink. Like, I don't even understand why it's here, but it's because Slappy is a character, right? I don't know. So, Erica, you're a little younger than I am, right? Did you, did you. You didn't watch Goosebumps on tv, did you? [00:06:00] Speaker C: No, not very much. At least the like, digital media that we did have for Goosebumps when I was growing up, I didn't have cable. For context, we had a lot of DVDs and it just kind of manifested in our house one. I don't even really remember how we got the DVD, but it had a ton of the episodes from the original show, I'm pretty sure. And I got my hands on that when I was like 10, after I had started reading like the book series and had gotten really invested and I was like, this is peak media right here. I am all in for this. [00:06:37] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. But I. Did you, did you watch them growing up? [00:06:42] Speaker D: I did watch them growing up. I was one of those was, yeah, admittedly kind of cheesy, but it was also one of the coolest things that we had from, you know, a really popular book series at that time. So I was very invested. [00:06:56] Speaker A: Well, I watched them growing up. I was about five when it started airing. And I gotta tell you, that was not cool. That one with the sponge with the horrifying red eyes and the teeth and it lives under the sink. So I want to talk about R.L. stein's penchant for taking domestic items and Turning them into objects of horror. Right. Like, I mean, Adrian, were talking about this earlier. Like, you know, there's this movie, huh? [00:07:24] Speaker B: Like the cuckoo clock of doom. [00:07:25] Speaker A: Like the cuckoo clock of doom. But like, in a horror movie, you're going to take something that your audience is associated with in a very general way and turn it into an object of horror. Like, I. I brought up the movie. It's not a very good movie, but it's a great example. Mother. Right. The. Who directed that? The Aronofsky. The Aronofsky movie. And it's like a horror movie aimed at women, where the household is turned into a. Oh, dear. Okay. Fucking Riverside. You're okay. Yeah. But no, you know, he turns the domestic household setting into a place of horror where they're eating her baby and there's all these strangers there. Well, if you're writing horror for children, what's scary? Weird dummies, Cuckoo clocks. Your dad's old clock. You know what I mean? The basement. Your dad goes down to. To play with his model train or eat his plant food, you know, because he's a. And like. Yeah, like. Like the idea of there being something under the sink. Because little kids don't go under the sink. And when they do, what do they see? They see a bunch of trash bags and cleaning chemicals and things that they don't. They don't. Nothing to do with. Yeah, exactly. Like. And I just think that it's. It's. [00:08:28] Speaker D: They remember Monster Blood. [00:08:30] Speaker A: Yeah. Do you want to talk about Monster Blood? That's a classic. [00:08:33] Speaker D: It was one of my favorites. It really was. [00:08:35] Speaker A: What happens in that one? [00:08:36] Speaker D: It's like the green goo stuff that grows and eats everything and grows and grows and never stops. [00:08:45] Speaker A: You know what my favorite thing about that book is? The kids. The boy's dog is named Trigger. I never forgot that. That's such a great detail, isn't it? Let me think. So something I find interesting is that the endings are often different. You know, like in Night of the Living Dummy, like in the book, they smash his head and then, like, it's. He's the guy who smashed his head, leaves and Slappy grabs the girl's hand and goes. I thought he'd never leave. In the show, not so much. Right. He just, you know, he's gone. He's put into a trunk and that's the end of him. I don't know. So where should we go next? Erica, what are some of your favorite episodes? [00:09:26] Speaker C: I think one. That's two. That still kind of linger in my noggin I don't remember the titles for them, but like the werewolf episode, that boy and his parents kind of move to like a quieter part of the suburbs and things just start going really, really strangely and they're like over involved with their vet. And then if I remember at the end of that particular episode, it turns out that he wasn't even really like a child to begin. He had always been a dog and they were just hopeful for a child. So like reverse engineering there. It was a fever dream sort of situation for me. And then the one with like the piano instructor, a haunted piano sort of situation. This one I remember a lot more vaguely just bits and pieces, but this girl is wandering the halls and like her school from what I can remember, or like a conservatory of some sorts after she starts taking lessons. And I honestly can't even remember how that episode ended. Just the specter in that particular episode was the weird thing for me because it was like, okay, so this instructor is like a viable, living, breathing human. And then all of a sudden it's like this not human chasing her. That's not great. I don't want to take piano lessons ever now. [00:10:50] Speaker A: You know, it's interesting that you mention a werewolf because they did a few werewolves. There was one where this, this, this kid's mother has a new boyfriend and he's weird and they start, he starts to suspect that he's a werewolf. And by the end of it it's like I know he's a werewolf. Isn't it great? And at the end of it they're, they're playing fetch with him on the night of the full moon. Adrian, did you want to talk about the one that horrified me as a little boy? I had nightmares about this. It wasn't cool. I think it came out when I was like 6 or 7 and it was a VHS release. The Werewolf of Fever Swan. [00:11:23] Speaker B: It was my favorite of the books. And I just re watched the film today and they change a lot. But I'm gonna tell you, it was actually not as easy as I was expecting. Like it had better production value than some of the other episodes did. But it's this boy moves in with his family in the middle of nowhere in Florida. And there's this swamp. And of course, like a curious kid, he goes to investigate, gets lost, and then he starts hearing weird noises. And then this dog comes out and he. In the book he names the dog Wolf, but they call him Vandal in the series, in the episode, but like, you know, it turns out his best friend who you Would never suspect was actually the werewolf. And his name is Will Blake. Like, William Blake. And I thought that was, like, absolutely brilliant and hilarious. Thank you, Erica, for knowing what I'm talking about. [00:12:21] Speaker A: Werewolf, Werewolf. Burning bright in the forests of the night yeah. [00:12:25] Speaker B: The werewolf sinks into a swamp, and then his, like, decaying body comes out later. It's like, yeah, that's the end of it. [00:12:33] Speaker A: That's. It's horrifying. Yeah. I don't like. I mean, I like it, but, you know, as a child, I was like, no, no, no, no. [00:12:39] Speaker B: Really good. And at one point, when, like, the mom and the sister in the barn and stuff, it, like, turned into Silver Bullet. And I was like, dude, this is, [00:12:48] Speaker A: you know, it's interesting. Like, I love. We love monsters on this show. Like, we have a special penchant for monsters. Me and Adrian are confirmed monster. You know, like, that's the thing. Like, what. [00:12:59] Speaker C: I was gonna avoid the term, but now that it's been thrown out there, I'm a happy camper. Yeah. [00:13:05] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, hey, you know, like, if Frankenstein or Nosferatu would have come over. I mean, I've got the tea on. On the kettle. You know what I mean? I got the cakes ready to go. I'm just saying. So, like, what I love about Goosebumps. [00:13:17] Speaker C: Horny Nosferatu memes. [00:13:18] Speaker A: Oh, everybody wants Nosferatu. But no, but that's the thing. Like, this show, Goosebumps, these books, they're full of monsters. And I find it compelling that a lot of things made for adults are not. Like, there was Del Toro's Cabinet of Curiosities recently. That was a Netflix series. [00:13:36] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:13:37] Speaker A: It's brilliant. It adapts one of my favorite Lovecraft stories, Pikmin's model, actually, you know, speaking of monsters. But, like, that's like an outlier, you know what I mean? Like, it's very rare that horror aimed at adults focuses on. It's usually, like, serial killer stuff. [00:13:51] Speaker D: Slashers. [00:13:53] Speaker A: Slashers, right. Like, obviously, like, me and Adrian, we talk about, like, there was the movie Cuckoo recently. That was fucking great. I mean, it's horrible. Horrible, Horrible. Cheap. They are indeed awesome. It's funny. I was actually editing our Blade episode today. You know, this is gonna be released later. So, you know, But I was editing our Blade episode, and I make that. I make the joke that we're talking about Blade, and I hold up the puppet. The first Puppet Master movie, you know, because his name is Blade. But I digress, right? There have been lots of Goosebumps products. Thinks since that first 95 show and these, you know, the Serena books, which, you know, is very popular from 95 up till sometime in the aughts. I mean, like, you know, I have a few books from. Well, I have a book from what's called Slappy World, which is an imprint of Goosebumps, where Goosebumps was insanely popular, but certain characters were more popular than others. And this other one, Horrorland, which are books set in Horrorland, as it were. Right. You know, in this Slappy World books book, it's called the Dummy Meets the Mummy. Yeah. There's old Slappy getting. Getting eaten by a mummy, which is amazing. But my point is that they were pretty popular up till some indeterminate point in the. You know, probably 2010 or something like that. And like, there was the show. Then there was. There were those two terrible movies with Jack Black, you know, and there's been a reboot since. There's. There have been two other shows. I tried to watch one of them. All the teenagers were saying things like Riz and I couldn't hang. [00:15:30] Speaker B: I. I have to tell you, I loved that one mostly for the one moment where Justin Long is dancing around listening to the 500 Miles song, and he's dancing around with this broom and eating worms. And it literally made my whole life worth living. Like it was. It was everything. [00:15:49] Speaker A: Well, you know, I wish I could find fulfillment like that. That level of fulfillment in anything, but, you know. [00:15:54] Speaker B: Yeah, Flappy's Slappy ends up being the bad guy in that one, too. [00:15:57] Speaker A: Yeah, he's too popular. He's too popular. I want to talk about those two stupid movies with Jack Black. Did you guys watch them? [00:16:03] Speaker C: Yeah, I've seen one even know they existed. [00:16:05] Speaker A: I'm sorry to. I'm sorry to let you know. Yeah. So they suck spoilers. They don't go. They don't try to be scary. They try to be funny. They have CGI monsters that look like cartoons. It's not like charming CGI like me and Adrian talked about. [00:16:22] Speaker B: Welcome to Derry. [00:16:23] Speaker A: Thank you. Welcome to Derry, which has a lot of cgi, but, you know, it's. It's used in such a way where it's almost charming, like bad puppetry or something like that. You know, these movies, not so much. [00:16:35] Speaker D: Right. [00:16:36] Speaker A: Like, and the thing about Goosebumps is that, like, when you're watching them, when you're watching, let's say, Bad Hair Day and the rabbit's talking, that's funny because you're. You're. You're an adult. Right. Land of the Living Dummy. It's hilarious because you're an adult, you've seen this done well. But it's made earnestly because if a child's watching it, they haven't seen dolls or Dead Silence or whatever. You know, they haven't seen the Orphan or something like that. Like, that's scary to them. The dummy's talking. Or Cuckoo Clock of Doom where it turns the child in, into a little baby. Like, they haven't seen movies that do this stuff well, so it's scary to them. And like, that's the thing about all this other stuff. It doesn't understand its audience and it doesn't treat the material with reverence. Whereas, like, you know, Adrian, there have been two shows. Like, do they at least try. [00:17:28] Speaker B: The first one I thought was actually, I enjoyed it. I liked, I liked the one with Justin Long very, very much because it did have some things in there, but it was still not for little, little kids. It was more for teenagers who were into the books. So it was kind of like, I guess like an updated, like, ooh. So they actually did try to like, put some, like, actual scary content and some, like, interesting content in that one. The other one with David Schwimmer was so absolutely God awful, I could not finish it. I couldn't do it. I was like, done. And it's, it's, it's kind of. It's following the plot line with, you know, the dad with the plant goo and stuff like that. [00:18:06] Speaker A: Interesting. So what you're saying is that with the, the first one, the first reboot, not the movies, but that first reboot, the one, you know, the one with Justin Long, it was kind of trying to grow up with its new audience. [00:18:18] Speaker B: That's exactly what it was doing. That's exactly what it. [00:18:21] Speaker A: Sorry, I see you nodding. Did, did, did you watch that show? Did you have thoughts on it? [00:18:25] Speaker D: So my niece was really into it and I did not watch, like, I watched the first episode just like it. But I got to hear all about it constantly, so. [00:18:35] Speaker A: Damn. [00:18:36] Speaker D: But I mean, for the age group and also I got A. He's 14 now. But at the time that it came out, you know, it's been a few years ago now. So, like, it was kind of geared at, like, what I feel like is like that tween group more than anything and make it a little more edgy. [00:18:53] Speaker A: Well, how do you feel about that? Like, do you feel like. Do you feel like it's. It's good for children to have dedicated horror like that? [00:19:01] Speaker D: I mean, I think that making Age appropriate for each, you know, because there are little kids that immediately are like taken in with Halloween stuff like that. And they're not scared, they're just. They like it and they think it's fun. And then there are those that are terrified. So of course as a parent you have to look at every, you know, what kind of content best suits your kids. But I think it would be a disservice to, to say, well, we should only make it at this age. I mean, we're see, we see, you know, all kinds of great scary content in different ways. Even with it being Christmas time and you look like a Christmas carol. You know, there's ways that to make it interesting and give the original content the kind of reverence like you were talking about it deserves. And I do feel like in ways that they, with every Goosebumps rendition they've tried to do, it hasn't quite quite hit the mark for me of the greatness of the books. And that's just my opinion. But nothing hit the book. [00:19:55] Speaker B: Yeah, nothing hits the book. The books are sacred. Like, that's like a whole other. Whole other. [00:20:03] Speaker A: I think you'd be hard pressed to really, you know, do do something different than what they were doing in the 90s and hit that mark because yes, they changed the stories. But at its core, like R.L. stine is taking something mundane and making like say cheese and die. It's an old camera in the show. They make it look like, like a weird Victorian space camera. It kind of looks like a toaster, but it's still just a camera and all the horror centers around it. You know what I mean? And like, that's the thing, like in, in the, in the, in the book, I'm pretty sure it's just a Polaroid camera. Polaroid cameras are fucking creepy. They're weird. I don't, you know, I love them, but when you take those pictures. Yeah, yeah. I mean, my grandmother has one and like, it doesn't work, but she has it. And like, it's fascinating to play with because like you take a picture of someone, the. The picture pops out and it always looks weird. It never looks right. You know, there's something mysterious about it. And the idea of there being like a cursed like Polaroid camera, that's not too, I mean, that's not, that doesn't feel far fetched when you're eight, you know, because it's mysterious. How does that fucking thing work? Get that out of, get it out of my face. I. Look, I. Despite being a little bitch when I was younger. I loved monsters. I loved scary things. And kids in general love monsters. You know, it's just a thing. I mean, whether it's the type of monsters that are Godzilla's or the type of monsters that are Frankenstein's, Kids love monsters. It excites them. I was just talking about this with one of my clients, actually. Like, little kids love Halloween, but we domesticize Halloween. You ever hear of trunk or treat? [00:21:36] Speaker C: It is ruining the spirit of Halloween. You don't see kids trick or treating anymore, [00:21:44] Speaker A: right? Like, Halloween, it's. It's all monsters and plastic body parts and, like, gravestones and witches and all kinds of horrible things and, like, fake blood and haunted houses, and we're like, oh, we want you to be safe. So we're gonna go to a parking lot, and you're gonna go from trunk to trunk and get candy. Then we're gonna go home, and we're gonna make sure there's no razor blades or poison in it. And, like, I get it. I don't have kids. I think the only one here who has kids is Adrian. I get it. I get it. You don't want your children. [00:22:19] Speaker B: I have never taken kids to a trick or treat. I'm just letting you know, we go real trick or treating in this house. [00:22:26] Speaker D: We go to a haunt every year. Like, sometimes two haunts every year. My kids love Halloween. [00:22:32] Speaker A: Yeah. Wait. Sorry, sorry. Do you have kids? [00:22:34] Speaker D: Yes. [00:22:36] Speaker A: I'm sorry. I should have asked. Okay, got it, got it, got it, got it. [00:22:39] Speaker B: He's used to me being the only one because I'm the old lady in the group. [00:22:42] Speaker C: You're not an old lady lady, Adrian. [00:22:44] Speaker D: I mean, I'm old enough to have three kids that are adults. [00:22:47] Speaker B: I mean, you look like you're 25. [00:22:50] Speaker D: Well, thank you. I appreciate the compliment. I'm not quite that young. My daughter is about to be 24, so. [00:22:58] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh. [00:22:59] Speaker A: I actually thought you were around Erica's age. Like, Erica's in her 20s, too. [00:23:03] Speaker C: Thought you were about, like, my sister's age, maybe. I have some siblings in their mid to, like, mid-30s now. Because I'm the youngest. [00:23:12] Speaker D: I'm 41. [00:23:14] Speaker A: Damn. Cool. [00:23:15] Speaker C: My oldest sister would be 46 this year. [00:23:18] Speaker A: Cool. [00:23:19] Speaker D: You don't look. You don't look a day over 30 to me, Adrienne. [00:23:23] Speaker B: Well, you look like you're in your 20s to me. [00:23:25] Speaker C: That's very young. [00:23:26] Speaker B: I'll take that compliment, too, hon. You're amazing. [00:23:29] Speaker A: We're very supportive here on this show. [00:23:31] Speaker B: I'm so mad. [00:23:31] Speaker D: This is. This has Been great so far, but. Yeah. [00:23:34] Speaker A: Well, so. So psy. Do you watch this with your kids, then? [00:23:38] Speaker D: Yeah, we. I mean, some of them. I. I watch different types of content with my kids. The biggest thing right now is Stranger Things. [00:23:44] Speaker A: But, yeah, I was gonna go. I was gonna go there actually, because, you know, we really should cover Stranger Things at some point. I have very strong opinions on it, of course, because I'm an edge Lord and I'm me, and, you know, I look at everything from a critical perspective, but, like, it has its place. Adrian, go ahead, tell us. Tell us why you watch Stranger Things with your kids. [00:24:02] Speaker B: Is it' fantasy sci fi horror for kids? Like, it's stuff that kids can relate to. Like you said, like the early Goosebumps. It's the same thing. It's something that they can relate to that, honestly, they've gotten to grow up with. Right? They grow up with the kids as the kids grow up. And so the stuff that they deal with is, you know, like, where my kids are in their life. Like, it's really interesting and kind of exciting, but it is. [00:24:30] Speaker C: It's. [00:24:30] Speaker B: It's horror for kids, right? [00:24:32] Speaker A: It's. It's horror. You know, I. I mean, I. Sy. Is that your experience with it as well? Do you watch it with your kids? [00:24:38] Speaker D: Exactly. [00:24:39] Speaker A: It's. [00:24:39] Speaker D: And it's not just. It's a good starting point because if they're going to be interested in these things, it's something that we can all do together. And, you know, my daughter's older now, so now she's into other types of things. But it really was my kids that were like, mom, you should watch Stranger Things. [00:24:55] Speaker A: Keep. [00:24:55] Speaker D: Come watch this with us. So I was like, okay, let's do this. And since I have interest in things like Stephen King, and there's obviously that influence. You see how the intersectional. It's there. [00:25:06] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. There's even Nightmare on Elm street stuff in the fourth season. It's so fun. [00:25:12] Speaker D: Yes, it really is awesome. [00:25:14] Speaker A: Right? And I feel like someone like me, who's just watching it, like, I. I'm missing the point because, like, I'm like, oh, this is just like ET with some IT elements, like, go to hell with your fucking pastiche. But Adrian's like, yeah, but, like, I watched it with my kids and they enjoyed it. [00:25:29] Speaker B: Yeah, it's. It's there. It was, you know, introduction. [00:25:32] Speaker A: I feel like. I feel like the Stranger Things Hate Train is kind of like watching Goosebumps and being like, look at this. What is this schlock? You know, and it's like, it's not for you, dipshit. You know, like, it's a. It's for a totally different audience. It's for. It's for the juice box crowd, man. You know, they're not going to watch. They're not going to watch Keeper. They're not going to watch the Ugly Stepsister. [00:25:52] Speaker D: Like, oh, that is so good though. [00:25:55] Speaker A: The Ugly Stepsister is great. And I do think you should show that to your children. I'm just kidding. Please don't show your kids. [00:26:01] Speaker D: Say that. Most of my kids are adults. Like, so some of this I can now. And you know, it's. [00:26:08] Speaker A: Oh, wow. [00:26:09] Speaker B: What is that? Like, is it amazing? [00:26:12] Speaker D: I see Nosferatu, my daughter, her best friend, last December, but like I said, they are 23, so I can't wait. [00:26:20] Speaker B: I can't wait. I'm so excited to hit that point. Like, we've gotten to where we can watch the aliens movies and stuff now. [00:26:27] Speaker C: That's how Favorite stuff to do with my dad. [00:26:31] Speaker A: Watch movies. [00:26:32] Speaker B: Yeah, it's cool. [00:26:33] Speaker C: Watch Chucky. Growing up with my mom, dad got me right on all the Alien and Predators movies. And now that I am an adult and just off on my own, I watch all sorts of weird new stuff and I'm like, hey, mom, let me traumatize you a little bit. [00:26:47] Speaker D: My dad, that's what Dan. [00:26:49] Speaker B: His grandmother too. [00:26:50] Speaker A: I do. That's my grandmother. I made her watch Leprechaun 4 in space. She did not like it. She was not impressed. [00:26:56] Speaker C: I think the very first leprechaun movie I saw, I was like nine and it was with my dad. And it was Back to the Hood. [00:27:04] Speaker D: I seen the first one, the Hood [00:27:05] Speaker B: Here to Do no Good. [00:27:08] Speaker A: Speaking of bad, bad things, The Leprechaun, Leprechaun 5 in the hood. That's the best directed one which says something about that series. The directing is pretty good. It's just a bad movie. I had a follow. [00:27:19] Speaker B: That's Coolio. Is that Coolio? [00:27:21] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, Coolio's in that movie. Yeah. He's not in Back to the hood, the sixth one. It's just so good, right? So, R.L. stein. [00:27:27] Speaker C: Beauty. Oh, I'm so sorry, Dan. [00:27:29] Speaker A: No, no, no. Go ahead, Erica. Talk about whatever it is you're talking about. [00:27:32] Speaker C: I think that's the beauty of having media like Stranger Things and Goosebumps. Especially though, because like some of the films I saw when I was younger is probably not how you should be introducing your children to horror media. I feel like this gives you and your children the opportunity to explore new things and interests and, like, the feelings that come with them. Especially because younger kids can be very easily frightened by things they haven't seen or experienced before. It gives you the chance to reframe those things and be like, okay, here's the situation. But it's different than, like, face value, right. Where you can process those emotions differently and kind of rewire your brain so it's not as traumatizing as it would have been initially. And then at the end of the day, maybe it's this new, beautiful thing that you're interested in. Right? [00:28:18] Speaker A: Yeah. Don't be like, my mother who showed me Night of the Living Dead when I was, like, 4, and I didn't appreciate that. It was pretty horrifying. Especially when the. When the little girl picks up the cake, the cake knife, and starts stabbing the woman in the face. Like, yeah, yeah, maybe show them goosebumps, you know? Goosebumps is appropriate. [00:28:36] Speaker B: It was house of wax. [00:28:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Like, I think kids can handle certain things. Like, again, like, I. I say that about Night of the Living Dead, but, like, I also saw RoboCop when I was little, which is a horrifically violent and sexual movie, and it was the most amazingest movie ever. So, you know, case by case basis, [00:28:55] Speaker B: watch the movie with your kids so you can judge, so you can see how they're processing it and be like, are you. [00:29:03] Speaker D: That's that parental guidance. [00:29:06] Speaker A: Parental guidance. [00:29:08] Speaker B: Parental guide suggested. And I love things like Goosebumps, for example, because it is something fun you can watch with your kid, you know, and you can watch it together. I was watching one of the episodes today. It was that. It was that first one, the girl that cried monster. And at one point her dad was like, I thought this was just a phase you were going through. And she's like, my whole life is a phase I'm going through. And I was like, dude, that's actually, like, legit. [00:29:35] Speaker C: Especially relatable. [00:29:37] Speaker B: Yes. [00:29:38] Speaker A: I have. I have. I have a short essay from someone named Shannon Lewis. It's called From Roald Dahl to Goosebumps. Horror and Children's Lit. Right. And it's about all these things. But here. I'm just gonna go here and read this. The thing is, if you're here reading this article, you were probably a child who likes horror. It's not something that came to you as an adult when you were the right age and maturity to handle it. No. It came in the form of urban legends spread around the playgrounds or girl whose head was only attached to her neck. By a green ribbon. It was reading scary stories to tell in the dark and going down into the basement even though the shadows glared. There's something about horror, about being afraid that draws us in at any age. I remember being 11 and visiting the library with my grandma during the winter holiday. I was picking up a stack of books to keep me entertained for the next two weeks. I grabbed some standard fare. Nancy Drew, Little House on the Prairie, Railway Children. But among stories of little girl detectives and prairie life, I was also reading ghost tales about haunted cars and evil spirits. I was picking up Fear street and Goosebumps. And, yeah, she goes on for a while, but her point is, horror, as it appears in children's literature, has a wide range from accidentally terrifying to deliberately creepy. Right. And that's the thing. This article also has Roald Dahl in its title and luck. I mean, if you've read fantastic Mr. Fox, if you've read the PFG, you know, the BFG, a book where giants literally eat people and crunch their bones and talk about how delicious and wonderful it is and make jokes about it. [00:31:07] Speaker B: Well, you were talking about the Goosebumps one with the rabbit earlier and how the book ending is completely different, but it's very similar to the ending of the witches when he gets let's talk [00:31:21] Speaker A: about bad hair Day. So in the book, the kid finds out that his favorite magician is actually the rabbit controlling a dummy. And the rabbit is incredibly rude. And that's. It's kind of a. It's kind of a lame duck ending. It doesn't make any. It's just. Whatever, okay. The magician was the rabbit the whole time. That's not really scary or interesting in the show. The episode what happens is his sister gets disappeared, and there's a talking rabbit who's like, I was a magician, and the magician that made your sister disappear, he turned me into a rabbit. And, like, he brings his sister back, but the magician catches him and turns him into a rabbit. And then it ends with the magician putting the two rabbits into a guillotine and the episode just abruptly ending. That's amazing. [00:32:02] Speaker C: Child murder. [00:32:04] Speaker B: Yay. [00:32:05] Speaker A: That's great. Like, a little kid's gonna watch it and be like, oh, no, I hope they got out. And that feeling of fear. And then the credits coming on. By the way, the intro to that show is amazing, but. Yeah, but the credits coming on, like, it's this catharsis where it's over. It's just a show. Or is it. You know, I think that, like, the intro to that show is amazing. Because it's creepy. Right. And, like, so much work probably went into shining that silhouette. Not silhouette, the shadow of the G over the physical set. Because there was no. They weren't using computer graphics for that. That's awesome. And then you see a dog and its eyes turn into cartoon demon eyes. And it's like, ruff, ruff, ruff, ruff, ruff, ruff, ruff. Like, a little kid's. A little kid's gotta find that funny, right? I don't know. [00:32:48] Speaker C: I haven't. [00:32:48] Speaker A: I haven't been five in a long time. [00:32:50] Speaker B: So it reminds me of Erie, Indiana. Like, the. [00:32:54] Speaker A: What'd you say? [00:32:55] Speaker B: The intro to. That reminds me of the intro to Erie, Indiana. [00:32:58] Speaker D: Erie, Indiana. [00:32:59] Speaker A: Right. Tell us about Erie, Indiana. I know what it is, but tell our listeners about that. [00:33:03] Speaker B: Erie, Indiana was my favorite when I was a kid. It's about this boy who's looking for proof that Erie, Indiana has monsters and all sorts of supernatural stuff. And he has, like. He keeps all of these, like, roof things and it goes through each story. But one of them had a dog with, like, glowing cartoon red eyes like that. And it was really funny. It was the one with the kid with the braces who could. It was child horror. That's exactly what it was. That might have actually been the first horror thing I had access to as a kid was Eerie, Indiana. [00:33:35] Speaker A: They're monster hunters. [00:33:36] Speaker C: Yes. [00:33:37] Speaker B: Yes. And I wanted to be a monster hunter. So they were my heroes. Marshall was my hero. Hero. I was in love with Marshall Teller. I'm not gonna lie. [00:33:45] Speaker D: He was awesome. That also reminds me of. So weird. And Are you afraid of the dark? [00:33:52] Speaker A: Well, it's interesting that you bring that up. Are you afraid of the dark? Was on the air at the same time it was on Nickelodeon, I believe. Right. Yeah. It's funny. We were talking, so I was misremembering the say cheese and die episode because Are you afraid of the dark? Ripped it off. Like, instead of, like, you know, the kid's friend falling off of the banister or whatever. Like, he takes a picture with his little camera and the locker falls on him. It's stuff like that. I do think. Are you afraid of the dark? Had some better episodes. But I didn't really watch it in preparation for this. So I. I don't really want to speak on it too much, but you're welcome to. [00:34:30] Speaker D: I was just gonna say the one that I remember the most was the Banshee one. That one was pretty creepy. [00:34:38] Speaker B: It was. [00:34:40] Speaker A: These shows were pretty great. Again, I don't know that anything like this is on. I don't know what kids do these days. Do they watch network tv? I don't have cable, so I don't [00:34:50] Speaker B: even know if network TV is, like, a big thing anymore. [00:34:54] Speaker C: I think most, like, not really. [00:34:56] Speaker B: You have TVs that automatically, like, they're streaming. Like, they're, you know, like, digital TVs that, like, you know, Roku and stuff like that. You don't have, like. [00:35:06] Speaker C: Yeah, when I turn on my tv, it's straight to streaming apps. [00:35:10] Speaker B: Me. Yeah. [00:35:12] Speaker A: I mean, I want to highlight. I mean, Goosebumps was a big deal when we were kids. It was so popular. It had Happy Meal toys. There was a. There was a hamster. I think his name was Cuddles. Like, I had his toy. It was very cool. It turned inside out. Yeah. Like, they were happy. Like, you know, like, McDonald's doesn't just give Happy Meal promotions out. Like, they don't just license anyone. You have to have the money to do that. And, like, you know, kids were reading this stuff. They were watching it on tv. They were talking about it. You know, I remember talking about Egg Monsters from Mars with my friends at school. Like, we liked it. It was cool. It was fun, and it led us to read other books. And I just don't know that that's as much of a thing. Like, there's an issue with literacy these days. And, you know, as far as, like, kid Kitty Horror. Yeah. There's Stranger Things. I don't know what else there is, though, you know, So, I mean, I have two moms here. What do you guys think? [00:35:59] Speaker D: Like, Stranger Things, obviously. But also, Joe Hill has this show. It's on Netflix now, but it started out on AMC. It's called Nosferatu, but it's like N0S 4T or 2U. And it's. It's kind of the premise of it is this, like, guy takes these kids to a place called Christmasland, and it. It's a little bit more nefarious than that, but, like, it's like, you know, like a yule creature that comes and takes children, basically. That's the simplest way I can put it. [00:36:32] Speaker A: That's Nosferatu. [00:36:34] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:36:34] Speaker B: Yes. [00:36:36] Speaker D: It being by Joe Hill, it's really good. It's. It's really good. [00:36:41] Speaker A: Adrian selling this. No, no, no, no, no. You did a terrible job of selling this to me. [00:36:48] Speaker B: It depends on how well you were listening to me. [00:36:50] Speaker A: I have a thing where I don't like Joe Hill because he's Stephen King's son, and I'M like Nepo, baby. And I read his first book, and it sucked. It's called Heart Shaped Box. It's terrible. It's terrible. It's so bad. It's such a bad book. But he's written other things that are probably really good. Like, I watched the Locke and Key show. I love that show. And that's based on his comic book, right? Speaking of stuff for kids. Horror for kids. I mean, fucking show your kids Locke and K, man. [00:37:14] Speaker B: I did, actually. [00:37:16] Speaker A: You did? Yeah. Yeah. And I clearly is like, Yeah, I know. Thank you. Thank you, jerk off. You know, I've seen it. Did it. So, like. Yeah, no, I. Okay. Nosferatu. All right, put it on the list. You know, we're gonna have to do an episode where, like, I say nice things about Joe Hill after I. I read several of his books. You know, so. That'll be fun. [00:37:33] Speaker B: I get to, like, throw balloons or confetti or something at that. [00:37:37] Speaker C: Okay. Little party poppers. [00:37:45] Speaker A: Anyway. Okay, so where should we go next? What do we want to talk about next? I'm a little unprepared. What'd you say, Adrian? [00:37:52] Speaker B: Oh, I was gonna ask, man. [00:37:53] Speaker A: You're breaking up, bro. What? Say it again. [00:37:55] Speaker B: What was your favorite story from Goosebumps? [00:37:58] Speaker C: I was a big fan of Mr. Puppet, man. I'm right there with Dan. I'm a sucker for dolls. Killer toys. I feel like him and Chucky were, like, the catalysts of my horror addiction as a child, because it was that extra little bit of, oh, that might happen in reality for me. Like, my mom was an avid porcelain doll collector when I was little, except she didn't put them in her room. She put them in mine. They were on shelves around my bed. So when I was like, four, I was already terrified that they were going to come alive in the middle of the night and just mark. Maybe because they were upset for whatever reason. And then I saw media like that, and it just exacerbated that issue for me. [00:38:45] Speaker A: I like that. I like that. Slappy calls people his slate. He calls people his slave. Bride of the Living Dummy, which came out long before Bride of Chucky. So Don Mancini is a hack. [00:38:55] Speaker C: Speak on my boy. [00:38:56] Speaker B: Like that. [00:38:56] Speaker A: Just saying. He stole from R.L. stine. I'm just kidding. [00:39:01] Speaker C: Everything is borrowed. There's no such thing as an original thought. [00:39:05] Speaker A: Art is a conversation. [00:39:06] Speaker D: 12 archetypes of storytelling. This is true. [00:39:09] Speaker A: 12 archetypes. That's right. Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep. Listen. Art is a conversation. Conversation. I say it all the time here. I'm Just kidding. But so in Bride of the Living Dummy, Slappy decides he likes this girl's like, American Girl doll. It's like a doll. It's this big. [00:39:23] Speaker C: I had one of those too, and that was bad for me. [00:39:26] Speaker A: You had that. That's crazy. [00:39:27] Speaker B: They are legitimately, like, knee height. [00:39:30] Speaker C: They are terrifying. [00:39:32] Speaker A: Love it. I love it. By the way, Slappy's design in the show is fucking great. Like, I love it. He's got the weird things on his [00:39:38] Speaker D: cheeks, the hint mouth. [00:39:41] Speaker A: So basically, he steals this girl's doll, he brings it to life, and things start disappearing from around the house. And at the end, the mom's like, my wedding ring is missing. And she's like, slappy, you can't give that wedding ring to Mary. Your my doll. And he goes, I don't want her. I want you, dummy. You're my slave. And the doll's like, how could you, Slappy? And she smacks him and they both fall off the thing and break. And that ending makes no sense. It's not built up at all. It's just. [00:40:09] Speaker C: Okay, you know, it's just there. [00:40:12] Speaker A: It's awesome. [00:40:13] Speaker C: That is iconic. I'm here for it. [00:40:15] Speaker A: I love it. It's a great episode. By the way, R.L. stine famously interviewed Slappy. Let's. Let's take a look at that before you start asking questions. RL I have a question for you. Why do you enjoy writing about me so much? Is it because I'm brilliant and clever and wise? Or is it because I'm so good looking? Did you know when I look in a mirror, the mirror says the thank you? I like to write about you because you're so modest, Slappy. When you look in the mirror, the mirror says humans only. And you're always so kind. I'm kind to animals. I never step on them unless they're in my way. Let me ask you this. Do you believe you know, do you have a personal motto? I'm a big believer in the golden rule. Do it to others before they do it to you. That's kind of evil. That's kind of evil. Your face is kind of evil. Does it hurt you? No. Well, it's killing me. [00:40:59] Speaker C: He's so sassy. [00:41:01] Speaker A: I know. Isn't it great? A lot of people want to know what your favorite food is. Well, fifth graders are my favorite, but sixth graders can be delicious too. They're a little tough, so you have to cook them longer. So, you know. Yeah, that's Slappy. He likes to eat children Also, I think 5th and 6th graders are most likely Slappy's target audience here. Man, there are a lot of these Slappy world books. Holy 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. That's 12, 19. Oh, my God. Diary of a Dummy. Oh, is that a play on Diary of a Madman? Slappy in Dreamland, I am Slappy's evil twin. Slappy, Birthday to you. You know, at least he's having fun. So I guess we can wrap up. So my favorite books were Go Eat Worms, Night of The Living Dummy 1, Night in Horrorland, and Stay out of the Basement, you guys. Sigh. What are your favorites, if any? You could say Episode Dame's too. I don't Care. [00:41:53] Speaker D: Curse of the Mummy's Tomb, Night of the Living Dummy. [00:41:56] Speaker A: Classic. [00:41:57] Speaker D: The Werewolf of Fever Swamp one we didn't talk about. The Haunted Mask. [00:42:01] Speaker C: Oh, that one is my favorite. [00:42:03] Speaker A: Speaking of which, that one changes the ending too. You can only take it off once. So she uses her mother's symbol of love, the paper mache mask, and takes it off. It's very dramatic. And then the brother is like, hey, look at the mask. You know, in the show, the dog steals it at the end and buries it while it's yelling at him. You know, were there any other psy or was that it? [00:42:24] Speaker D: Was that as far as Goosebumps. And then there was Monster Blood for Fear Street. It's the Fear street saga, which are the first three. Betrayal, the Secret, and the Burning Prom Queen, Night Games and Secret Admirer. [00:42:37] Speaker A: Very cool. Very cool. Yeah, the Fear street movies that are on Netflix are great. They should. You do. Don't watch them with your children. They're very bloody and very, very brutal. But they are great. You know, I'm saying this. You know, I'm saying this for the viewers, not for you. Sigh. I'll edit that out. But yeah, definitely do recommend those. Adrian, did you want to list your favorites? [00:42:57] Speaker B: It was the Ghost Next Door and Werewolf of Fever Swamp. Werewolf of Fever Swamp was my just absolute favorite. I actually kind of enjoyed Deep Trouble too. I'm not gonna lie. It had a mermaid. [00:43:09] Speaker A: Of course it had a mermaid. Erica. [00:43:13] Speaker C: Haunted Mask is definitely a favorite in the Night of the Living Dumm Ones. The Blob that Ate Everyone was one of my like, mmm. This was surprisingly goods when I was reading them. I remember the name of that episode I was talking about from earlier too. Piano Lessons Can Be Murder. I didn't read it, but that episode had me all sorts of messed up as a kid. [00:43:35] Speaker A: You know, the Blob that Ate Everything brings up something I forgot to touch on the COVID art. That book has an incredible. His comic book art looking blob. Just consuming an entire town with that face. It looks like Krang from Ninja Turtles or something, you know. So gross. Absolutely, man. That's a great list. And you know, if you haven't read any of these, you should check them all out and you should buy them all for your kids and let them read them. Because you know what? It really doesn't matter what your kids read as long as they're reading. And I think that kids should be exposed to horror. [00:44:09] Speaker C: I think get them a box set and read a chapter every night with them until you get through every book. [00:44:17] Speaker A: Because you know what? Like, I, I had a pretty, like I had a pretty traumatic and tumultuous childhood and having things like Goosebumps there were. Were very fun because in a lot of ways the spooky things in those books were really not as scary as what was going on in my life. And the fact that I was able to still be afraid of like a fake sponge really says the resilience of children, you know. So any, any final words before we go into our wrap up? [00:44:42] Speaker D: It's. It's lasted as long as it has and has continued be, you know, remade in different ways because it really is awesome. Children's horror. It really is a good place to start kids off. [00:44:51] Speaker A: I would agree with that, actually. You know, actually, it's funny, you know, when I was going to the library looking for books, they didn't have any because they were all checked out. They're insanely popular still. So all my naysaying and doomerism. Who cares? Kids are reading these, so. Yeah. Adrian, any final words? [00:45:11] Speaker B: Reading never goes out of style. [00:45:12] Speaker A: You don't need that. [00:45:15] Speaker B: I said reading never goes out of style, Erica. [00:45:17] Speaker A: Did I, Did I ask you for final words already? Do you have any? [00:45:21] Speaker C: I think it goes without too much saying that children's media can be a lot more than meets the eye. And it's definitely worth considering looking into if you haven't before, if not for yourself, then for the little ones in life or around you, introduce them to something new. [00:45:37] Speaker A: More than me. It's the eye. All right. Yeah, so that's that. Obviously I'm, you know, King Loki. Check out Death Wish poetry magazine, deathwishpoetry.com Our winter edition will long be out by the time this comes out. Check out my books if you want to. Demielandbooks.com Also, you can hire me to edit your book or talk to you about your writing? I do writing. Coaching. Nightcapright.com Adrian, do you want to plug your stuff? You want me to do it for you? [00:46:08] Speaker B: Yeah, please. I'm bad at this. [00:46:09] Speaker A: Yeah, Adrian. Adrian is of course, the wait timeout before I do that. Are you doing taking commissions? [00:46:15] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. [00:46:16] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. Adrian. Adrian is the chairperson of the Horror Art Film Society of Amarillo and also the managing editor of the Goblin Crypto Art and Culture magazine. And she's also an incredible, incredible artist who takes commission. So if you need a book cover or you want someone to draw your erotic Dracula slash Mumrah painting, talk to her and she'll do it for you. Erica, you want to do your plugs? [00:46:46] Speaker C: You can also find me on Instagram. I write. Sometimes I post poetry inconsistently, but I'm trying to get better at it at Monstrum Exempla. [00:46:55] Speaker A: Yeah. Yep, yep, yep. Links to all these things below. Psy. [00:47:00] Speaker D: Well, I am a poet, obviously. That's what brought me here. But I'm also an author and a screenwriter, and I provide services that include editing and ghost writing, story development. You can find me on Instagram @authorcymarie and basically symaree everywhere. Simarie Johnson. I'm on just about all of the things. TikTok, YouTube, whatever. I also host histories of Horror podcast. I drop true crime or supernatural episodes every other Sunday. So if that's something that's interesting to you, you can check me out doing that too. [00:47:35] Speaker A: Very cool. Very cool. And on that note, write poetry, make art, and love your demons. Ave Satanas. It.